Room acoustics

[Mr_Brightside]

I'd like to position my computer on the 'Main Wall' ideally, but that means that my speakers aren't firing down the longest length in my room. It does mean that my monitors and PC can sit central on that wall, which it can't do on the other side walls (due to the doors there).

Is that much of a problem? Where would you guys position the PC and monitors?

Thanks again for the help

Paul

[thebeagle]

I wouldn't worry unduly about it, no; personally I would go for symmetry over firing down the 'ideal' dimension too, just means you might want to concentrate your first-reflection-point absorbtion more on the rear wall than on the sides.

[*Noodles*]

I'l give you some perspective:

Most extremely high end studios use NS-10s to monitor and mix on.
They're mounted on solid wooden desks.
The rooms are often treated very well, so they are hearing the NS-10 and vibration of the desk combined.

don't worry about things are you must/want to do - you'll get 7/10ths of the way there,.. and the rest is all skill and knowing what you're doing!

*Edit - I should note that the NS-10 driver / box combination is awful, for those that don't know. They're great for a 'hi-fi' sound.. but they're not studio quality to my ears.

[thebeagle]

I'l give you some perspective:

Most extremely high end studios use NS-10s to monitor and mix on.
They're mounted on solid wooden desks.
The rooms are often treated very well, so they are hearing the NS-10 and vibration of the desk combined.

don't worry about things are you must/want to do - you'll get 7/10ths of the way there,.. and the rest is all skill and knowing what you're doing!

*Edit - I should note that the NS-10 driver / box combination is awful, for those that don't know. They're great for a 'hi-fi' sound.. but they're not studio quality to my ears.

There was a pretty in-depth paper I read a while back exploring why the NS10 is so ubiquitous; it compared frequency response and waterfall impulse response charts of loads of different monitors and the ONE thing where the NS10 bossed almost everything else was response to transients, frequency response etc it was roundly pissed on.

I think there is something in it though, it's one of those 'if it sounds good on this it'll sound good on anything' type speakers and that COULD be down to the very unforgiving impulse response.

[Mr_Brightside]

Okay, so I've took a picture. Not sure if I've done it right but had a good go!

I calibrated my sound card and took a reading of the with the behringer mic.

Fingers crossed

Paul

[thebeagle]

Nice one; would have been nice to go a little bit lower as the low bass regions are generally where you'll get the worst problems, but that's a LOT better than relying on guesswork!

The thing that leaps out at me is the 30dB difference between your 100Hz peak and the trough at 50Hz, which from some back-of-a-fag-packet maths is probably caused by a standing wave along the longer dimension of your room (a single wave at 100Hz will have a length of around 10.5ft, a half-wave at 50Hz would be the same, hence where you get massive reinforcement with one the other will give massive cancellation).

With such a big and obvious resonance, I'm going to recommend something which drifts in and out of fashion like flared jeans - tuned absorbtion. If you could make a bass trap or two tuned to 100Hz it should massively even out the response of the whole room - I gotta go off and do some 'actual' work now (), but have a Google of 'tuned bass traps' in the meantime, Ethan Winer writes some very easy-to-read stuff about DIY acoustics in particular (http://www.ethanwiner.com/basstrap.html).

Good luck, I'll hopefully be able to go a bit more in-depth tomorrow if Noodles doesn't beat me to it!

Oh, quick edit for a question I'll need the answer to to help further - about where in the room was the measurment mic when you did yer testing? Cheers,
Ian

[Mr_Brightside]

Cheers for the help Beagle! I'll set about giving tuned bass traps a quick google now.

Cheers

Paul

P.S. I set up the mic in my listening position.

[Mr_Brightside]

Also meant to say, the room has no treatment in it whatsoever at the minute. Will start treating 1st reflection points tomorrow and then take another reading.

Cheers

Paul

[thebeagle]

P.S. I set up the mic in my listening position.

Which if I remember right is going to be about halfway along the long dimension of the room? Totally figures with that 50/100Hz resonance if it is.

Also meant to say, the room has no treatment in it whatsoever at the minute. Will start treating 1st reflection points tomorrow and then take another reading.

Good man - be aware that without tuning, 'normal' absorbtion is only really anywhere near effective at 1/8 of a wavelength in thickness or more - so for the sake of arguement, for a panel absorber to be effective at cutting down a 100Hz resonance (wavelength = 10 1/2'), it'd need to be over a foot thick (not REALLY practical in most rooms ). If you've got space in the corners, broadband bass traps (also known as 'Superchunks') are a very effective way of evening out low-end response generally, and if you're any good with your hands can be made to look quite good too (and even be practical - I've made them into corner tables before now!)

'Course, reflection point panel absorbtion is hardly ever a bad thing as it DOES break up resonances and can be very helpful for cutting down the reverberation of a room (flutter echoes in particular are the bane of my life), so get stuck in and we'll see what kind of a difference it makes!

[Danny1969]

There was a pretty in-depth paper I read a while back exploring why the NS10 is so ubiquitous; it compared frequency response and waterfall impulse response charts of loads of different monitors and the ONE thing where the NS10 bossed almost everything else was response to transients, frequency response etc it was roundly pissed on.

I think there is something in it though, it's one of those 'if it sounds good on this it'll sound good on anything' type speakers and that COULD be down to the very unforgiving impulse response.

I mix on NS10's and yeah your right in terms of frequency response they are worse than average, especially below 80Hz or so. They are great are revealing harshness in the upper mids though, basically making nasty sounding things even more nasty. It's this mid \ upper mid frequency accurateness that makes them spot on for judging vocals and guitars. You need something else to judge the bass but for mids you can't beat them.

It's worth bearing in mind also that while the Ns10's have the reputation there are plenty of other book shelf speakers that will do a similar job and cost only a tenth of the price. I have a set of 90's Goodman speakers that are even better are revealing mids than the NS10's, but the other guys hate them so much sonically they had to leave the studio.