Pinched harmonics

[littlegreenman]

Erm , you can get a pinched harmonic on any note , the nodes only apply to open strings

By nodes, I was referring to where to pick to get each specific harmonic. The equation for which applies equally to fretted or open strings.

The fundamental octave harmonic being halfway along the string, open or fretted, etc.

[77Superbass]

There is some good advice in here that should get you there, but you may find it easier to get harmonics if you tune the strings down to drop D or all down a step as well!

[IanCorps]

ahhh I get what you mean now .. I need more coffee

[frankus]

By nodes, I was referring to where to pick to get each specific harmonic. The equation for which applies equally to fretted or open strings.

The fundamental octave harmonic being halfway along the string, open or fretted, etc.

I'm not sure learning the locations specific harmonics (beyond 2.5, 3.2, 5, 7,12) is much use as the ability to use these degrades with the string age and apart from Jaco Pastorius' Portraits of Tracy I've rarely heard them being used and it should be mentioned that's played on a bass and they're great for harmonics and have a lot more to exploit.

Country playing includes harp harmonics where a chord is fretted and the harmonics are usually played 12 frets above in the same pattern... these sound lovely but even using these 12 frets up requires some practice.

When it comes to pinched harmonics, it's better to dig around, find the ones you like with certain chords and memorise the position of the hands and the sounds - rather than plot them at all.

[Schpudd]

You can do pinch harmonics on an acoustic - I'm not talking about artificial harmonics. You don't need any funky pedals, you can even do them on a clean amp. It's all about technique - but to get the metal squeal you will need some gain present.

On your D or G string, hold the 5th fret - and pluck it. Keep this held down - and with your finger lightly (and I mean feather-like touch) touch the string where you would normally pick. If it starts to feedback and sound like a harmonic - lucky you you've found one of the places you can do a pinch harmonic. If not try again and move your finger up and down the string slightly until you find it. With a properly intonated guitar you should find many, many places that it works.

The trick is to hit this point as you pick - that's what makes the squeal. People hit it with the side of their thumbs, the underside of their thumbs, extra fingers - whatever. Do whatever's comfortable for you here. Personally, I'd go with the side of your thumb as it seems the most efficient.

[littlegreenman]

When it comes to pinched harmonics, it's better to dig around, find the ones you like with certain chords and memorise the position of the hands and the sounds - rather than plot them at all.

Isn't memorising the position of the hands and sounds the same as plotting them? Whether it's done haphazardly or with scientific precision, the end result is the same, n'est-ce pas?

[frankus]

Isn't memorising the position of the hands and sounds the same as plotting them? Whether it's done haphazardly or with scientific precision, the end result is the same, n'est-ce pas?

The end result for the listener might be the same but I don't think it is for the musician.

Apparently after the age of 11 we've lost the connection to the brain that makes learning times tables a doddle. People who've managed before that time have it in an interconnected mathsy-kinda way I don't have - what I have is 7x7 = ((3x7)x2)+7 or for some numbers a sound memory "seven sevens are forty-nine". The manner in which each number of the times-table is recorded is different - whereas people at the right time learnt it by rote.

So if the writing a chart and plotting them works for you, do it that way. It doesn't for me, I learnt the fretboard that way and forgot it, I learnt loads of scales that way and forgot them, what sticks is application and given that the nodes for pinched harmonics are devilishly close it's going to need kinesthetic learning and aural memory in order to be natural - so where does the plotting them come into it?

From my experience it's difficult to render scales from the harmonic nodes, the sequence spans strings and has no ready rule of ascending and descending on a string - there are trends and patterns - in short, I feel the complexity of the system to generate the cannot be internalised so, for me, it's better to think of them as self-contained glyphs than the deterministic result of applying a set of rules.

I've written a lot of words and sometimes verbose stuff like this can come across as arsey - that's not what I want, if it is working for you - I am pleased and I recognise that you're more capable at systematizing stuff than I, I'd like the opportunity to learn that from you, or at least try... if it's something you plan to do, then I apologize for listing a load of reservations that might be totally irrelevant for your journey - I hope you will not be confounded as I was - so please disregard it. If it's a belief that has not served you well (which is what it was for me) then and only then what I've written might be relevant... which makes me wonder if I should even press submit! what the hell, I've come this far

[littlegreenman]

The end result for the listener might be the same but I don't think it is for the musician.

Apparently after the age of 11 we've lost the connection to the brain that makes learning times tables a doddle. People who've managed before that time have it in an interconnected mathsy-kinda way I don't have - what I have is 7x7 = ((3x7)x2)+7 or for some numbers a sound memory "seven sevens are forty-nine". The manner in which each number of the times-table is recorded is different - whereas people at the right time learnt it by rote.

So if the writing a chart and plotting them works for you, do it that way. It doesn't for me, I learnt the fretboard that way and forgot it, I learnt loads of scales that way and forgot them, what sticks is application and given that the nodes for pinched harmonics are devilishly close it's going to need kinesthetic learning and aural memory in order to be natural - so where does the plotting them come into it?

From my experience it's difficult to render scales from the harmonic nodes, the sequence spans strings and has no ready rule of ascending and descending on a string - there are trends and patterns - in short, I feel the complexity of the system to generate the cannot be internalised so, for me, it's better to think of them as self-contained glyphs than the deterministic result of applying a set of rules.

I've written a lot of words and sometimes verbose stuff like this can come across as arsey - that's not what I want, if it is working for you - I am pleased and I recognise that you're more capable at systematizing stuff than I, I'd like the opportunity to learn that from you, or at least try... if it's something you plan to do, then I apologize for listing a load of reservations that might be totally irrelevant for your journey - I hope you will not be confounded as I was - so please disregard it. If it's a belief that has not served you well (which is what it was for me) then and only then what I've written might be relevant... which makes me wonder if I should even press submit! what the hell, I've come this far

The "map" as it were is not written down in my case, but as you have suggested has been learned kinesthetically. I "plot" things mentally. Might try actually writing it down and seeing if it changes anything or even helps. Complex yes, but not impossible to internalise.

Not wishing to get bogged down in semantics, I think we're probably heading the same direction, just from different angles. Possibly with a similar destination in mind. But as I'm sure you're aware, that damn inverse square law of learning always sneaks in there.

The more you know, the more you realise how much there is to learn.

[frankus]

The more you know, the more you realise how much there is to learn.

Which from my side of the fence is "The greatest wisdom is in knowing you know nothing"

The act of learning is a bloody sight easier than defining it!

[Noobshire]

It's good to 'plot' the 'nodes' (or pick in a particular spot as I like to call it), and using the last fret and pick ups as reference points is handy.

Remembering ofc that if you want the note that you are fretting to scream, then you'll need to know where the picking spot is on the string. As mentioned this will be about half way along the string from fretted fret to bridge. So for example, if I'm fretting around the 9th to 12th fret area, I know that the octave pinch harmonic is around the middle of the neck pick up. It's not really an exact science (unless you are discussing the science of sound, which we are not), but feel and experience.

I think that's what LGM are frankus are discussing? Yes, there is a science to it, but not in a usable sense; experience/experimentation accounts for more IMHO.